aging?

Started by tucktuck911, 08/31/2015 07:50 AM

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tucktuck911

What is the point? I get collecting things and how age can drive up value. but how much does it really affect the flavor.
don't get me wrong I am doing it I got cigars waiting in the humidor waiting to be smoked.
somebody please sell it to me...
because it sounds like the humidor business is just a secondary leach business off of cigar business.



plus I'm a typical American and I hate waiting... maybe that's my problem.

thanks guys.

quickme

Aging lets a cigar's oils and flavors mesh.  I have found that Arturo Fuente sticks benefit Greatly with age on them.   Patience is key to this hobby. Take your time and enjoy the moment.

StogieDad

Aging is tough when you have a small collection, as many smoke through that quickly.  Nothing wrong with that.  Its a bit easier as your collection grows, you can smoke one and stash the rest fairly easily.

Aging can have good (and sometimes bad) effects on flavor.  Most of the time, I notice a large benefit in the marrying of flavors and balance in a cigar the longer it sits.  There are some cigars that I know I won't touch for a long while after I buy.  There are some I know start to lose a little over time.

It is a personal preference thing on most I would say, certainly not required, just an aspect of the hobby.
"I drink a great deal. I sleep a little, and I smoke cigar after cigar. That is why I am in two-hundred-percent form."
-- Winston Churchill

"It has been my experience that folks who have no vices, have very few virtues."
-- Abraham Lincoln

"I call this turf 'n' turf. It's a 16 oz T-bone and a 24 oz porterhouse. Also, whiskey and a cigar. I am going to consume all of this at the same time because I am a free American."
-- Ron Swanson

headfirst

#3
Very interested to watch this thread.  Are there any leaf types/countries that age well versus others that don't or is it more about the particular blends? :?:

What I have heard before (here I think) is that mild cigars don't necessarily benefit from a lot of aging, but strong cigars smooth out over time...
When I have found intense pain relieved, a weary brain soothed, and calm, refreshing sleep obtained by a cigar, I have felt grateful to God, and have blessed His name...
-Charles Spurgeon

http://www.cigargeeks.com/index.php?action=humidors;area=public;member=headfirst

appollo

I know ISOM benefit greatly with aging. :-)

Jackal

Something to keep in mind, as these often get convoluted, there is a big difference between aging and resting.

All cigars can benefit from rest, letting them slowly stabilize humidity after shipping or when stored under different conditions than you use.  This is a process that will take 1-3 weeks.  The immediate benefits are significant, and not doing this is just burning your money.  It is kin to buying a can of coke that has been sitting on a warm self.  It can benefit greatly by putting it in refrigerator for a few hours.

Aging takes 6 months to a number of years.  This is much more akin to having a bottle of wine resting in your cellar.  Sometimes the extra age really improves the wine.  Sometimes it does noting, sometimes it turns it to vinegar.  This is the same with cigars, some benefit immensely from aging; some really don't change; some turn to garbage.

1-5 years usually wont hurt a cigar.  Beyond that, it really depends on the blend and how much the leaves were aged and processed before they were used to make the cigar.

I'll do what I will and I'll drink what I please
I'll smoke what I like 'till I cough and I wheeze
I'll drink and I'll whore and every pleasure realize
For this time tomorrow I may die


Camshaft83

Quoteheadfirst - 8/31/2015  10:02 AM

Very interested to watch this thread.  Are there any leaf types/countries that age well versus others that don't or is it more about the particular blends? :?:

What I have heard before (here I think) is that mild cigars don't necessarily benefit from a lot of aging, but strong cigars smooth out over time...

I smoke mild sticks with very little aging because I don't want to loose any of the flavor from them. But I have found in my experience that full bodied cigars or cigars that have a bit of a bite on the draw mellow out a little and become smoother with some good aging. A crappy cigar is a crappy cigar though too.
Tact is the ability to tell someone to go to hell in such a way that they look forward to the trip." Winston Churchill

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STL_Cohiba

Just from my own personal experience from the Cuban Cohibas that have been sitting in my box since 2010 to the ones I bought in July. I could most definitely see a difference in the aged ones vs the newer ones.
"The only way to break a bad habit was to replace it with a better habit." Jack Nicholson, explaining why he switched from cigarettes to cigars" -Jack Nicholson


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action=humidor&member=STL%5FCohiba

Jay'D

QuoteJackal - 8/31/2015  12:13 PM

Something to keep in mind, as these often get convoluted, there is a big difference between aging and resting.

All cigars can benefit from rest, letting them slowly stabilize humidity after shipping or when stored under different conditions than you use.  This is a process that will take 1-3 weeks.  The immediate benefits are significant, and not doing this is just burning your money.  It is kin to buying a can of coke that has been sitting on a warm self.  It can benefit greatly by putting it in refrigerator for a few hours.

Aging takes 6 months to a number of years.  This is much more akin to having a bottle of wine resting in your cellar.  Sometimes the extra age really improves the wine.  Sometimes it does noting, sometimes it turns it to vinegar.  This is the same with cigars, some benefit immensely from aging; some really don't change; some turn to garbage.

1-5 years usually wont hurt a cigar.  Beyond that, it really depends on the blend and how much the leaves were aged and processed before they were used to make the cigar.

I got the resting part with stuff coming through the mail but I don't think that would apply to cigars purchased at a local B&M right?
Last name Hungry first name Always

My hobby collection | http://www.cigargeeks.com/index.php?action=humidors;area=public;member=Jay%27D

Jackal

QuoteJay'D - 8/31/2015  10:02 AM

QuoteJackal - 8/31/2015  12:13 PM

Something to keep in mind, as these often get convoluted, there is a big difference between aging and resting.

All cigars can benefit from rest, letting them slowly stabilize humidity after shipping or when stored under different conditions than you use.  This is a process that will take 1-3 weeks.  The immediate benefits are significant, and not doing this is just burning your money.  It is kin to buying a can of coke that has been sitting on a warm self.  It can benefit greatly by putting it in refrigerator for a few hours.

Aging takes 6 months to a number of years.  This is much more akin to having a bottle of wine resting in your cellar.  Sometimes the extra age really improves the wine.  Sometimes it does noting, sometimes it turns it to vinegar.  This is the same with cigars, some benefit immensely from aging; some really don't change; some turn to garbage.

1-5 years usually wont hurt a cigar.  Beyond that, it really depends on the blend and how much the leaves were aged and processed before they were used to make the cigar.

I got the resting part with stuff coming through the mail but I don't think that would apply to cigars purchased at a local B&M right?

It really depends how your B&M stores them.  Some places really overhumidify their cigars, some keep them too dry for some peoples tatstes.  

A couple of my local ones keep them too wet; they tunnel right off the shelf.  A few days in my humidor, and they burn correctly.

If they keep their humidor where you like yours, then all should be good.  If not, a little humi time could help.

I'll do what I will and I'll drink what I please
I'll smoke what I like 'till I cough and I wheeze
I'll drink and I'll whore and every pleasure realize
For this time tomorrow I may die


toby2

my experience with my smokes is that aging helps most cigars. and most cigar shops have wet cigars, mail order or walk in, mail order being the worst. that being said a buddy of mine from Austin tells me they have outstanding shops there. i'm not that lucky. around here it's two moldy shops and one that you can leave the cigars on the counter for a few days and they would still be too wet.

amigodecigars

When I saw the title and at age 68, I thought of William Saroyan's statement to be released posthumously to the AP..."Everybody has got to die, but I have always believed an exception would be made in my case. Now what?"   Cigar aging; I agree with all that has been said by our fellow geeks who are very knowledgeable. Certain cigars are just naturally better suited for aging. An example is larger ring-gauge cigars. The thicker the cigar, the greater the variety of tobacco leaves and hence, the more complex the final flavor of the aged cigar should be.  The tobacco in most premium cigars is aged up to 2 years.  High-end premium tobacco is often 3 years old and some ultra-special blends use tobacco that’s been aging for more than a decade.  Visit a factory and stand next to a 5 ft. pilon of curing tobacco...feel the heat and the odor of formaldehyde.  Deciding how long your individual cigars need to be rested in a humidor is part of the passion, the hobby, being an aficionado.

 

"There are plenty of good five-cent cigars in the country. The trouble is they cost a quarter. What this country needs is a good five-cent nickel."  Franklin Pierce Adams

sevencardstud

"Eating and sleeping are the only activities that should be allowed to interrupt a man's enjoyment of his cigar." -Mark Twain


Ken Kelley

Quotetucktuck911 - 8/30/2015  11:50 PM

What is the point? I get collecting things and how age can drive up value. but how much does it really affect the flavor.
don't get me wrong I am doing it I got cigars waiting in the humidor waiting to be smoked.
somebody please sell it to me...
because it sounds like the humidor business is just a secondary leach business off of cigar business.



plus I'm a typical American and I hate waiting... maybe that's my problem.

thanks guys.


Good things happen to people who are willing to let them happen in their own sweet time. Cigars will let you know when it is time to enjoy them. Don't be in such a hurry to get to the chocolate center, bubba!

Relax...take a couple of deep breaths...turn off your iPhone, iPad, and iDon't Know What Other Electronic Leash you sport. Sit down in a nice lawn chair under a shady tree in a quiet area and fire up a nice cigar. Concentrate on the here and now. Otherwise you are going to pop a vein in your brain and wind up in a coma ward and cost the rest of us a bunch of money we can't afford!  :biggrin:
Guru of Benign Curmudgeonliness, Imperfect Patience, and Reluctant Toleration.



Mojo66

QuoteKen Kelley - 8/31/2015  4:39 PM  
Quotetucktuck911 - 8/30/2015  11:50 PM  What is the point? I get collecting things and how age can drive up value. but how much does it really affect the flavor.  don't get me wrong I am doing it I got cigars waiting in the humidor waiting to be smoked.  somebody please sell it to me...  because it sounds like the humidor business is just a secondary leach business off of cigar business.    plus I'm a typical American and I hate waiting... maybe that's my problem.   thanks guys.
Good things happen to people who are willing to let them happen in their own sweet time. Cigars will let you know when it is time to enjoy them. Don't be in such a hurry to get to the chocolate center, bubba!  Relax...take a couple of deep breaths...turn off your iPhone, iPad, and iDon't Know What Other Electronic Leash you sport. Sit down in a nice lawn chair under a shady tree in a quiet area and fire up a nice cigar. Concentrate on the here and now. Otherwise you are going to pop a vein in your brain and wind up in a coma ward and cost the rest of us a bunch of money we can't afford!  :biggrin:

 

Excellent advice there Ken. I think you could actually slow down aging with that.

Cool thing is, since our cigars age at their normal pace while we stay young(er) by slowing down our aging process, it's almost like the cigars were aging faster :biggrin:

"Life's too short to smoke bad cigars."


horrido

QuoteJackal - 8/31/2015  10:13 AM

Something to keep in mind, as these often get convoluted, there is a big difference between aging and resting.

All cigars can benefit from rest, letting them slowly stabilize humidity after shipping or when stored under different conditions than you use.  This is a process that will take 1-3 weeks.  The immediate benefits are significant, and not doing this is just burning your money.  It is kin to buying a can of coke that has been sitting on a warm self.  It can benefit greatly by putting it in refrigerator for a few hours.

Aging takes 6 months to a number of years.  This is much more akin to having a bottle of wine resting in your cellar.  Sometimes the extra age really improves the wine.  Sometimes it does noting, sometimes it turns it to vinegar.  This is the same with cigars, some benefit immensely from aging; some really don't change; some turn to garbage.

1-5 years usually wont hurt a cigar.  Beyond that, it really depends on the blend and how much the leaves were aged and processed before they were used to make the cigar.

X2 yup agreed and the fun part is also you forgot a certin stick and it is like Christmas all over again. Found a box of isom's I thought I had made disappear wow were they good 5 years on those plus the age of the leaf when bought was 4 years so they had 9 total very nice indeed.
"As you approach thirty, you have a thirty ring gauge; as you approach fifty, you have a fifty ring gauge."
-- Cuban saying

bmac7754

I think it a matter of preference as everyone has some good points.  I find that CAO's and Ramon Buesso really change after hanging out for a year or two in a good way.  I feel some of the cheaper cigars it really doesn't matter.  As far as the huge online retailers, I hear they undergo a deep freezing while there but I'm not positive on that.
As your collection grows you will find you are aging them no matter what because you simply can't smoke that many.  I personally think and hope the CG cigar gets better with time, especially because I smoked a fresh one right off the truck.  Time will tell.
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog." - Mark Twain




Longhorn

DE Undercrown come to mind when reading this... a little age does them wonders!

sar127

Any cigar you like fresh, smoke em fresh. Any cigar that to you find has a bite, too much strength, or too bold a flavor, set it down for a year and come back to it. You'll be amazed by the change. Hopefully for the better :biggrin:
Sir Rob

"I never smoke to excess - that is, I smoke in moderation, only one cigar at a time." - Mark Twain


Jay'D

#19
Buddy as you go along you will have no choice but to age those cigars wether you want to or not. Take me for example, I'm new to cigars and started just late last year. When I joined this forum and group of Geeks I had a 100 count humi that was not close to full, now I have two 100 count humi and a coolador and over 300 cigars and growing....now you think I can smoke all these cigars anytime soon, seeing that I normally smoke like 3 to 4 cigars a week??? OK I think you got the picture. Unless you dont have a humidor yourself, I see you making some B&M very rich in the coming future.  :biggrin:  :biggrin:
Last name Hungry first name Always

My hobby collection | http://www.cigargeeks.com/index.php?action=humidors;area=public;member=Jay%27D

05Venturer

#20
Quotesar127 - 8/31/2015  10:41 PM

Any cigar you like fresh, smoke em fresh. Any cigar that to you find has a bite, too much strength, or too bold a flavor, set it down for a year and come back to it. You'll be amazed by the change. Hopefully for the better :biggrin:

Rob is Spot on right here IMO.

Also if I buy a box I tend to "try" to smoke 1 very soon and then let the remainder sit  and revisit them to see if I notice a change. Some I do some not so much.
Really does depend on the cigar.
Kent
 Guru of Cynicism & Cigars

"Pump the brakes; you take your shirt off but leave your sunglasses on?" "What sort of backwards !@#$ing pageantry is that?" "You going to fight with those shades or play pokerstars.com?"

SparklePony

#21
While we'll all say it comes down to personal preference, there are a couple of things that aging certainly does to tobacco.  The first thing to note is that many plants including tobacco contain tannins.  It's the chemical that makes your lips pucker when you eat cranberries or an unripened raspberry.  They're these long chains of molecules that exist throughout most plants.  When you cure and ferment tobacco, these tannins begin to break down slowly and are part of the unpleasant taste of young tobacco.  The stuff is so strong that it was used for centuries in the tanning of hides into leather (hence "tanneries" and "tannenbaum" as the old German name for pine trees, a rich source of tannins).   Anyway, these tannins are such long molecules that they take a very long time to fully break down.  The longer the tobacco is aged, the more broken down they become, thus the aged cigar may seem smoother or rounder than a younger one.  The breakdown of tannins also leads to pleasant flavor combinations that may not exist in a younger (or older) cigar.  Since tobacco is a tannin intensive plant, we encounter tannins at many stages of decomposition.  This is why we sometimes get fruity flavors from cigars, or chocolate and fruit, or cracked black pepper.  The tannins in our cigars are similar enough to the tannins in other plants that we taste them as if they were those plants.    Hope that's helpful.
Yes, it's a pineapple hat.  No, you can't put your cigar out in it.


Cigary

QuoteSparklePony - 9/1/2015  12:43 PM  While we'll all say it comes down to personal preference, there are a couple of things that aging certainly does to tobacco.  The first thing to note is that many plants including tobacco contain tannins.  It's the chemical that makes your lips pucker when you eat cranberries or an unripened raspberry.  They're these long chains of molecules that exist throughout most plants.  When you cure and ferment tobacco, these tannins begin to break down slowly and are part of the unpleasant taste of young tobacco.  The stuff is so strong that it was used for centuries in the tanning of hides into leather (hence "tanneries" and "tannenbaum" as the old German name for pine trees, a rich source of tannins).   Anyway, these tannins are such long molecules that they take a very long time to fully break down.  The longer the tobacco is aged, the more broken down they become, thus the aged cigar may seem smoother or rounder than a younger one.  The breakdown of tannins also leads to pleasant flavor combinations that may not exist in a younger (or older) cigar.  Since tobacco is a tannin intensive plant, we encounter tannins at many stages of decomposition.  This is why we sometimes get fruity flavors from cigars, or chocolate and fruit, or cracked black pepper.  The tannins in our cigars are similar enough to the tannins in other plants that we taste them as if they were those plants.    Hope that's helpful.

 Great info that pretty much explains things...just like tannins in wine and for us wine drinkers we know that taste intimately.  I'm on the side of resting cigars just as a protocol....NC's or CC's....there is a true benefit for resting and as far as aging...5 years or more....not many of us have that kind of patience but I do and I can tell you that a well aged cigar is one of lifes grand moments.


Cigary

Quoteamigodecigars - 8/31/2015  4:14 PM  When I saw the title and at age 68, I thought of William Saroyan's statement to be released posthumously to the AP..."Everybody has got to die, but I have always believed an exception would be made in my case. Now what?"   Cigar aging; I agree with all that has been said by our fellow geeks who are very knowledgeable. Certain cigars are just naturally better suited for aging. An example is larger ring-gauge cigars. The thicker the cigar, the greater the variety of tobacco leaves and hence, the more complex the final flavor of the aged cigar should be.  The tobacco in most premium cigars is aged up to 2 years.  High-end premium tobacco is often 3 years old and some ultra-special blends use tobacco that’s been aging for more than a decade.  Visit a factory and stand next to a 5 ft. pilon of curing tobacco...feel the heat and the odor of formaldehyde.  Deciding how long your individual cigars need to be rested in a humidor is part of the passion, the hobby, being an aficionado.

 

 

 

 Just looking at those photos tingles me all over.



   
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